Maybe you aren’t aware of them, but there’s been multiple discussions about how new users don’t respond to welcome messages. It’s rare that people even respond to changeset comments. While I agree that people like us who put a lot of work into the social aspects have some experience of community, most people don’t. To give another example, you can look through most discussions here, on the Wiki, and on the mailing list. Most of the it’s the same 15 people asking questions and discussion things that it’s always been. Usually less. I’m sure you’d agree there’s way more then 15 users out there actively mapping.
It’s not doxing when you’ve openly said where use to work in public discussions, including in a mailing list discussion a few weeks ago. Nice try though.
Sure. But most people clearly aren’t forming those relationships. I’m not the one saying it either.
100% the reason I pointed out there are no community based groups in the United States cleaning up the TIGER data is because I want there to be and this seems like the type of discussion while floating those kinds of ideas would be useful. It has nothing to do with throwing rocks at anything. Let alone I’m disparaging “everybody” by pointing out something that’s an obvious fact. Anymore then would be if I said there’s no one mapping glaciers in Antarctica if there’s no one mapping glaciers in Antarctica. Whatever rock throwing you’d take out of something like that is 100% on you for being unwilling to show me the slightest amount of good faith.
I never claimed I was building community by saying what is wrong with it. Don’t put words in my mouth. You can never build or improve on a community if the slightest suggestion that it might need improving is met with gas lighting and vitriol though. It’s fine if we disagree on the specific details. I’m not the enemy here.
I can back up most of what I’ve said with evidence. And like I said other people are saying the same things I have been saying ad nauseum. In the social sciences there’s a concept that I think is pertinent to this. It goes something like this, there are personal troubles and public/social issues. Personal troubles involve an individual’s private problems in relation to others. Whereas, public/social issues are forces which are outside of the personal control of an individual. Community building by it’s nature is not a personal trouble, it’s a public/social one. I can’t not privately build community on my own. Me and my counslering are not the OSM community, obviously. Community building is also something other people in the project have a problem doing. So whatever dirt you want to throw about how I should go see a counselor or whatever if I think there’s no community, it’s not on me.
All I can do is point out where I think it’s lacking and hope that others will agree and we can come up with a remedy. That’s all I’m doing here. Nothing more, nothing less. The reason I decided to bring it up here is because I think it’s semi-related to why Overturemaps was created. Others disagree. That’s fine. We should all be to say what we think the causes of this might be.
I don’t have the time right now, but if you want I can find some quotes from other people that are extremely similar to what I said.