Hi,
Persian Gulf is the historical and international name of the gulf which is also recognized by United Nations. This name is also the native name used in Iran. However currently in your map an Arabic name is used which is not Persian Gulf. So why did you decided to not to use international, historical and Iranian name and only use an Arabic name?
reminder of geography:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_Gulf
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_Gulf_naming_dispute
Geographical names are in a local language. Persian Gulf borders with 7 Arabic-speaking countries and only one Persian-speaking country so that’s why it’s in Arabic.
Note that the gulf: https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/9326283#map=8/26.709/54.923
has the name defined for MANY languages, plus the default or local name as defined by the simple “name” tag and chosen by the logic described above.
It’s up to the map (not the database) to decide which language to show. Some maps use the local name. Some maps use the English name (name:en tag) if available. Some maps allow you to choose the language to display, example https://www.openandromaps.org/en/downloads/asia-middle-east which offers Arabic or English for this region. Another map shows the German name: https://www.openstreetmap.de/karte.html . And so on.
If the number of Arab neighbors caused the name of this sea to change from “Persian Gulf” to Arabian Gulf, then tell me why it was called “Persian Gulf” in the last 2500 years… Surely at that time, Arab countries spoke Persian. The most sacred document in proving the name of the Persian Gulf is an authentic hadith from the Holy Prophet (PBUH) that refers to the “Persian Sea” which is available in authentic Sunni historical documents.
These documents have been registered with the name of the Persian Gulf in the United Nations Global Committee on Geographical Names (UNGGEN), the IHO Association (World Hydrographic Association) and other international organizations.
اگر تعداد همسایگان عربی باعث میشد تا نام این دریا از “خلیج فارس” به خلیج عربی تغییر کند پس بگویید چرا در 2500 سال گذشته نامش “خلیج فارس” بوده… . حتما در آن زمان، کشورهای عربی فارسی صحبت میکردند. مقدسترین سند در اثبات نام خلیج فارس، حدیثی است معتبر از پیامبر اكرم (ص) كه اشاره شده به ‘بحر فارس’ كه در اسناد تاریخی معتبر اهل سنت، موجود است.
این اسناد در كمیته جهانی نامهای جغرافیایی سازمان ملل متحد (UNGGEN)، انجمن IHO (انجمن هیدروگرافی جهانی) و سایر تشكلهای بین المللی نیز با نام خلیج فارس ثبت شده است.
Do not discuss with me. I have no opinion on the subject. In my own
language, German, the object is even tagged “Persischer Golf” and not
“Arabischer Golf” because Germans use this name. The dispute is about
the “main” name tag which gets shown by default. Who should have the
authority to say? This is what the community needs to agree on. You need
to discuss with the community and not with me.
Hello
Dear Mr. Ramm
I haven’t written anything for you on this page and I don’t want to bother you with discussion.
I am talking to the whole community.
At your suggestion, I raised the discussion in the community.
In some cases, for different languages, communities have agreed to tag “name”=“Name in one language/Name in the other”.
E.g. Relation: Río Cuareim / Rio Quaraí (5122713) | OpenStreetMap
A Persian/Arabic bilingual name is probably the best approach for the Persian Gulf’s “name” tag, and probably also for nearby bodies of water like the Strait of Hormuz and Gulf of Oman, both of which also have the Arabic name as the “name” tag. The explanation in this article would support such a change.
Please see the international documents of the site below
and also
Please see these documents as well
در حقیقت خیلج عربی نام قدیم دریای سرخ است. الان هم ساکنان محلی ساحل دریای سرخ آنجا را به نام خلیج عربی می شناسند.
اما در مورد خلیج فارس مشکل تنها در نامگذاری نیست؛ کسانی که اصرار میکنند نام خلیج عربی روی اینجا گذاشته شود هدفشان این است که بعدا بتوانند مرزهای آبی کشور ایران را هم تصاحب و بر آن حکمرانی کنند…
If you are genuinely trying to come to a community consensus on this topic, posting a comment like that is not going to help achieve that consensus.
Just dropping in these related topics: Atlantic Ocean: repeated name removal and RFC: Intentionally omitted name tags
TLDR: Features with multiple valid names (and not just multilingual names) are a little difficult to deal with in OSM right now.
Dear SomeoneElse
I don’t want to start a fight. The documents that are available on the website below show what I said
www.persiangulfstudies.com
So don’t attempt to start a fight.
I don’t know why all this resistance?
What is the reason that you do not want to use the international name of the Persian Gulf as its main name?
I spoke with the Iranian Foreign Minister and the Iranian Judiciary, and soon a lawsuit will be filed against you in the International Court of Laha, if the name of the Persian Gulf is not changed to its original name.
In my opinion, it is not good at all that you are forced to accept international laws by a court order. In the international laws, the name of the Persian Gulf is a historical name that is 5000 years old, and contrary to the international laws, you have changed its original name to the Arabian Gulf, and you are asking others to call it the local name of the Persian Gulf.
In the past, we filed a complaint against Google Earth for changing the name of the Persian Gulf to the Arabian Gulf, and they had no choice but to accept the ruling of the international court. I never wanted this action to be taken against the OSM community, but with your continued resistance, this action by the Ministry of Affairs Iran’s foreign affairs will be held this year.
You have until the end of March 2024 to think and change the fake name of the Arabian Gulf to the Persian Gulf.
I have nothing more to say
I think the voices in this thread arguing for using the Persian Gulf name (@ChehrehBargi and @Ali_Zangeneh) would be better off trying to constructively help resolving this issue you mention. For instance by proposing concrete schema changes and/or developing useful name selection algorithms for renderers to use.
Throwing documents around without thoroughly engaging with the reasoning behind the current choice of name will get you nowhere. At least try to steelman the position you disagree with before attacking it.
Throwing legal threats at us will definitely get you nowhere and only makes it seems as if you’re arguing in bad faith.
Which fight? I have not started a war. The things I have said so far are not threats, they are events that have happened and we are witnessing them. Wherever there are multiple opinions, whoever makes a claim has to prove it, and I provide evidence for what I say. We are talking about the borders of a country. Certainly, all people of every nation are sensitive towards their homeland and love it. No one will be satisfied to be separated even a bit from the water and soil of his country.
کدام دعوا؟ من جنگی شروع نکرده ام. مطالبی که تا به حال گفته ام تهدید نیستند اتفاقاتی هستند که افتاده است و شاهد آن هستیم. در هر جایی که چند نظر مختلف وجود داشته باشد، هر کسی ادعایی دارد باید آن را اثبات کند و من هم برای سخنانم مدارک ارائه می دهم. ما در مورد مرزهای یک کشور صحبت میکنیم. قطعا همه مردم هر ملتی نسبت وطن خود حساس است و آن را دوست دارد. هیچ کس راضی نخواهد شد حتی ذره ای از آب و خاک کشورش جدا بشود.
This probably refers to attempted threats like
Just as a general clarification:
While I assume that that should be “Law” and not “Laha” it doesn’t really matter as it doesn’t exist. What does exist is the ICJ however that only hears cases between countries.
I would note that all the other legal “claims” are just as ridiculous.
