Why does StreetComplete sometimes choose less popular tag to use?

General talk Tagging general discussion
1

they say so, but in the past at least, there were cases where SC pushed tags against established schemes, e.g. maxspeed:type which was a tag only used on the British islands (and documented as such) instead of source:maxspeed which had much more use (and still has almost double after 9 years): maxspeed:type | Keys | OpenStreetMap Taginfo

Tagging swings with baby=no acceptable to realize a StreetComplete quest?
2

That is (among other things) why that sentence had a disclaimer in that [1]…

I just wanted to mention possible limitations which might apply to this particular subject (tagging baby-swing related data with SC).

The rationale for that specific decision can be found around SC #492.

Note that this self-imposed guideline[1] asking for tags to be established does not require that the StreetComplete chooses the most popular tagging method, just that it shouldn’t invent its own tagging not already used by other mappers.
Which tags suit the StreetComplete specific ways of using it the best should always be weighing all their pros and cons in that specific use case, and is not limited just to global popularity (although that is certainly a significant factor in making a decision).

But please fork a thread here if you want to discuss that particular maxspeed:type case (or StreetComplete behaviour generically).

  1. and not an dogmatic law, even if taken quite seriously ↩︎

1 Like
3

My favorite quote from this:

I reckon that is a relatively weak line of argumentation

4

That seems like misunderstanding on your part[1]. To give the context, this is what was said:

I thought the whole thing through again. I think I will actually change that for implicit street limits, always the maxspeed:type tagging scheme is used, for every country. Because:

  1. StreetComplete is kinda misusing source:maxspeed, even in the documented not-accepted-by-the-British interpretation of the tag, because source:something always refers to something. But StreetComplete does not set that something (maxspeed) in that case.
  2. the fundamental critique of source:maxspeed is correct anyway - the convention is that source:* describes the source of the tag. An implicit speed limit type/zone is not a source.
  3. the definition of maxspeed:type is solid and there is no reason to not also use it outside of Great Britain.
  4. worldwide data consumers need to look at both maxspeed:type, source:maxspeed (and zone:maxspeed) anyway to derive a concrete speed limit for an implicit one, so it shouldn’t make much difference anyway.
  5. source:maxspeed can be (automatically) inferred from maxspeed:type, but not the other way round, as source:maxspeed may contain other values, such as sign, survey, imported data from open datasource XYZ...

I reckon that is a relatively weak line of argumentation, because one can argue that maxspeed:type also refers to a maxspeed, but I’d say, less so, plus, point 2 and 5 definitely speaks for maxspeed:type.

Also, I need to note this down here: This is not an argumentation about the deprecation for source:maxspeed or anything but just my rationale which tag among several alternatives this app shall use.

IOW, if you read that more carefully, you’ll note that this (self-acknowledged) “relatively weak line of argumentation” applies only to 1st bulletpoint[2], and not about whole argumentation.

I mean, it even explicitly says that in that same paragraph you’re quoting from. Bulletpoints 2-5 are quite strong argumentation even each for itself, and especially when combined together.

Now, one may argue why they think those bulletpoints combined still do not outweigh the popularity of source:maxspeed, and that would be quite valid opinion, and they’re welcome to it.

And if their argumentation for change is persuasive enough, it might cause the change of the tag being used (note that StreetComplete did originally tag source:maxspeed but was persuaded to change tagging to maxspeed:type in commit c7c9537657)

To me personally, as it stands currently, those 5 arguments above hold more weigh then the single “but source:maxspeed is more popular that maxspeed:type” argument (which is the only one I’ve seen), especially as we’re talking about same order of magnitude of popularity, and not some more dramatic differences[3].

But I’m willing to engage in discussion about it[4], if you (or other people) have more/better arguments for the change.

  1. at last I hope it is just a misunderstanding, and not intentional misrepresentation ↩︎

  2. about source:maxspeed defining the the source of maxspeed being invalid when there is no maxspeed tagged at all ↩︎

  3. as e.g. hundreds of usages vs. millions of usages might be – which would sway my opinion ↩︎

  4. for all the good that it might make: I’m not the one with authority to decide what StreetComplete will use, I can only make the suggestion. Hopefully my suggestion might hold some weigh with powers-that-be in SC; but it only could work if the argumentation is convincing enough on itself anyway ↩︎

5

It is now in a similar order of magnitude, after 8 years of SC quests, when SC started to push maxspeed:type it was levels of magnitude less used.

I agree that 2) is a valid argument, (although the established idea about tagging sources is that it should be done on changesets and not on objects), 1) is about SC internals, 3) is just a confirmation that maxspeed:type is the same as source:maxspeed with a different key name, 4) is only true if you wanted to support the UK, and 5) is not correct, as maxspeed:type also has the sign value, it is the same.

No worries, we now have 2 generally synonymous keys for the same thing everywhere, not just in the UK, it is not a big deal, just an additional minor nuisance